Tomas Jr. L. • life is a continous quantity surveying, it never dies wether in business or in personnal life..materials, costs, success, failures, bad or good..it has all quantities to analyse and study....
YJ P.
YJ
YJ P. • Agree, QS role can be replaced by A/C and Engineer. Worse still, it's just the assist department not the core role in the industry. The ceiling of this career is obvious, sigh!
8 months ago
Alan H.
Alan
Alan H. • It's tiresome to read this kind of post. I've read this nonesense since I was a trainee, many years ago. A properly trained QS has a mindset that others can only hope to emulate. I don't say I can design parts of a structure, so I don't understand other disciplines saying they can "be a QS" - they can't, if they're not trained. I would point to the growth in the profession, and the demand on the Job Sites for QS's, as sufficient evidence that the skills are in demand. Yes, there are poor QS's out there, as there are in the other professions. If a client secures a good QS, then he can rest a lot easier than if he let a non-QS loose with his budget. But carry on posting the negative things. After all, there's no such thing as bad publicity!
Evance
Evance N. • I disagree. QS field is not dying..., the only problem is that incompetent or untrained QSs are the ones bruising the good reputation and invaluable skills rendered to the construction industry. Nowadays, clients want value for money projects and QSs are better equipped to advise the client on the same. QS should adapt to technology and globalisation for them to survive like in any other construction professionals. To Engineers or other construction professionals doing some QS's tasks such as BQ production and valuation does not mean you are fully QS.
Simon Mark B.
Simon Mark
Simon Mark B. • The problem is that the Plutotonic state of supply chain agreements for engagement of professional services and certainly the ability within the UK to tender these through business networks in central London ensuring that all our best graduates ensue to central London. Try ringing a client to even get on the list and you end up hiring a Private Investigator sat in an office car part cross referencing car number plates. Even in this regard they are not trained as per say a solicitor or barrister in that they have extensive client networking skills. This is due to nature of most Partnerships being equity based and the in availability of business development funds from international banking or funding organisations to buy shares. To secure certain positions in private equity funds you must buy an exclusive directors share. As a professional body we detract our brightest and most enthusiastic graduates in the realms of global finance and other higher yielding professions whilst we bog down our best in to highly technical professions especially from lower 'class' back grounds or force those who wish to achieve in gaining money for directors shares in to business dealings with friends. Even our global power is diminished due to the lack of historic international networking even in an information age from our professional bodies and in some circumstances these professional bodies act as barriers to entry in a competitive market. We are reliant as with most professions on a intricate network of business acquaintances which are exclusively in the realms of the more affluent. Apparently he joined that one there to go to that one there!
Simon Mark B.
Simon Mark
Simon Mark B. • I forgot to mention that this is the unwillingness of many clients to engage the services of small business enterprises with limited marketing budgets - they still want that meal at that Micthelin star restaurant. It is like Murdoch doing the rounds with MP's monopoly money at times. Even with a marketing budget to approach members of the Institute of Directors or the Free Masons funds are limited in times of such austerity.Should a client contact be secured even in this regard the loops are so exhaustive that many of our brightest do not even consider being a QS as a worthy professional as some of us still believe in contributing to society as opposed to making money for the already affluent. Even many of our local government services are outsourced to profit making large multi-nationals only a few constructive trusts remain and even then many of our clients doors remain firmly bolted to career progression as many senior managers consider it a job for life and instigate in fighting as opposed to team work in an archaic management style not in keeping with current management thinking.
Simon Mark B.
Simon Mark
Simon Mark B. • Need I go on or are those letter to the president of the RICS being typed yet?! Need we complain anymore before we change as a society or must we still be ranked as the second largest Plutonomy before we change. Because frankly - right now - it is like an exodus, but it cheaper to engage a graduate recruitment fair, business as usual, let the next generation figure this all out for them selves. It is easier to do that than buy a mirror, take a good long look at ourselves and change for a brighter future!
Teddy F.
Teddy
Teddy F. • The QS profession is not dying but rather it is being destroyed by other professionals in the construction industry who are performing the duties of the QS
Andrew G.
Andrew
Andrew G. • I think you will find that a QS can potentially apply their particular set of skills in many parts of the world. They may not be producing a BofQ, may need to make some adjustments, learn some new skills, generally adapt and re-brand themselves, but ultimately, the cost management of construction projects will always be a requirement.There is a lot of potential for the growth of QS type services in some parts of the world, particularly where cost management is not always done with the same degree of professionalism. I admit, however, that, for the large part, you will have to work within the prevailing structure and set up of the area you're in. When BIM finally does come of age, it actually offers very real opportunities for significant growth of a seperate discipline of independent cost consultants. This is particularly true of areas where, in the past, neither a separate independent discipline, nor the BofQ has really traditionally flourished. Whether quantity surveyors see and act upon these opportunities, or whether others will seize the opportunity remains to be seen.
Simon Mark B.
Simon Mark
Simon Mark B. • The inescapable fact is that these discussions are always prevalent when the UK industry is in decline - what are we up to now 58% sector reduction since 2007? I mean - we are reliant on private funding with banks not lending anything and a UK economy pretty much bankrupt. We learn that large multi-national practices make experienced staff redundant whilst recruiting graduates in to current Cash Cow Markets. It is cheaper and easier to do this than retrain the work force of a total organisation, so long as the share holders (mostly equity) are happy who cares? The fact is inescapable.
That although the QS function is extinct as with most of the building trades and professions here in the UK, we are and will continue to be in specialist shortage occupations in other parts of the world and secure excellent VISA allocation points as a consequence. Should organisations, like bankers, account to gready equity partners or shareholders in extensive marketing of a diversification of services to which they would have to train an existing workforce to exploit. They make the vast majority redundant and look to management to train a new enthusiastic gradute instead - it is simply cheaper corporate strategy. Look at Value, Risk Management - prevalent cash cow services kept for associates or equity partnerships for services prevalent in the USA industry for 50 years. That's how originally the UK industry thinks - lets them have something 'new; to talk about on the golf course or over that A La Carte Dinner - a bit like BIM. Remember this industry is economically cyclical and a stop valave to the UK economy - that is why the UK has had no economic growth.
There is very little point in trying to exploit a dog market even with extensive diversification - it is cheaper, simpler and more time and cost effective to simply log a VISA application. Look at Davis Langdon (my old firm) I lost count after the 5th round of reduancies. No company ever anticipated it would be so extensive or so pro-longed a starvation of project funding which has direct consequence to the employment of all (not just QS's). I thought you lot were so clever as to be able to kiss enough ass to get that share option so cheap, or I am not ashamed to call myself top of class of 2001? Oh yer and poor too! But I must confess I am on my third VISA. I mean lets take a brief look - my CV is worth £35,000 PA in the UK or £220,000 ay year in Dubai and £60,000 in Australia/New Zealand - what you think it is in the UK - join the gravy train?
Simon Mark B.
Simon Mark
Simon Mark B. • Oh and like any good company you think the share holders want to take a cut in dividend -of course not so just shaft the workers, the attitude is that the profit margin absolutely must paramount remain the same under any market circumstances.. Plan, simply 'business sense'. But you know I always saw a load of sub aquatic species after my seventh RICS complaint and the fourth employment tribunal. I had three directors along the way though!
Chuks A.
Chuks
Chuks A. • All Contributors to this Topic did justice to it!!! However, what the Quantity Surveying profession need is a evolution process that will address future needs of the profession holistically.
Just as this discussion started here, i call for a Global Colloquium on the future of the Q/S profession.
To remain relevant, we must research proactively into future needs of our services to the world.
1 month ago
Craig H.
Craig
Craig H. • An interesting discussion. I have been in the profession for over 25 years and, as far as I can recall, this debate has been on-going even since my university years back in 1985.
The skills and services offered by Quantity Surveyors have evolved over the years as our industry and client requirements have changed. This is no different to any other profession and should be seen as quite normal and indeed, necessary. I do however find it quite disconcerting that I have not heard of our sister professions, engineers, architects and the like having the same discussion. Their professions have also been impacted by similar trends and technological developments but I have not perceived a similar level of pessimism about the future of their professions.
Quantity Surveyors have, in fact, made substantial inroads into the engineering arena and are, and should continue, to assume a leading role in all cost, procurement and contractual related aspects associated with any construction or engineering project. Our training and variety of skills is by far the most suited of the construction related professions to the development and control of these aspects of a project.
What remain is for the profession to continue to provide excellent, relevant, proactive services to our clients and peer professionals and the profession will not only remain an essential part of any serious, quality minded construction team but will become an even more relevant contributor to the built environment.
Millan D.
Millan
Millan D. • I totally agree with Craig Hinde and Chuks Arinmah. QS professionals must be proactive and must lead a role of Cost Management rather than Cost Reporting. Today's Construction world it is essential that the Quantity Surveyor take a leading role of Commercial Management and Cost Management.
4 days ago
Carlos H.
Carlos
Carlos H. • The Quantity Surveying Profession is so diverse,that it could never become a dying profession. I've been in the industry for almost 32 years, now having before studied Mechanical Engineering,Civil Engineering and Project Management. I have had my own PQS practice for 18 years now, and it is so immensely rewarding. We attain and learn something new everyday.So my advice to students who are wanting to enter a career in Quantity Surveying, you have my blessing and you won't be sorry,I assure you.
IT IS NOT OVER YET,ETI MO NKANKAN
The lingering strike actionn embarked on by the Academic Staff Union of Universities, ASUU, Chairman, Kogi State University Chapter, Sylvester Osakwe Ukwuteno, has said the union is ready to fight until their request is granted, even if takes more than a year, as he noted that Ghana experienced a year and some months strike before the government came to their senses and the outcome is currently obvious, “we would do even more till our request is granted,” he stated.
Despite the N30 billion released to the striking university lecturers as payment for the earned allowances, Ukwuteno, has said that the ongoing strike by the union will continue because the Federal Government has not strengthened its vision for the sector.
Speaking to Vanguard Learning in a telephone interview, Ukwuteno explained that if there are plans for the sector, government would have speedily concurred with the plea to innovate the sector being pursued by the union, adding that the pursuit of the union is to ensure that the country meets up with the international standard of education.
“We hope this would be the last strike that will surface on this particular discourse, hopefully if the government cares for education because we will not budge until our demands are met. The much emphasis of ‘no money syndrome’ is all lies as the president could convey over 300 entourage including himself, to China coupled with their allowances, welfare and other incentives, they should tell Nigerians where the money is coming from.
“The quest is not money motivated as speculated, but to ensure that facilities and other necessary equipment needed to update the students are made scalable for effective learning. Universities are currently operating with little or no equipment in the labs, making the labs non-functional for practicals, thereby sterilizing what is supposed to be practically inclined.
“It took Ghana a year and some months strike before the government came to their senses and the outcome is currently obvious, we would do even more till our request is granted.”
He therefore urged the public to join in the struggle by mounting pressure on the government to hasten up in its decisions because the students are the casualties now, but will be the benefactors if eventually granted.
Effect of this.....
Uncle Calling From Abroad...
Uncle: How are you doing ?
Osagie: Fine o.
Uncle: So When Are You Gonna Graduate ?
Osagie: I Don't Know Ooooo.
Uncle: Why Don't You Know, Is it Not A Four Years Course?
Osagie: For Nigeria, With ASUU ? Your Graduation Comes To You Unknowingly Like A Thief In The Night! Lol
The federal government Tuesday released the sum of N30 billion to the Ministry of Education for onward disbursement to the universities for the payment of earned allowances of the striking members of the Academic Staff Union of Universities (ASUU).
Making this disclosure, yesterday, at a meeting with the National Association of Nigerian Students (NANS), at the state Governor’s Lodge in Abuja, Benue State Governor, Mr. Gabriel Suswan reiterated his appeal to the striking university lecturers to return to the classrooms in the interest of the future leaders of the country.
Suswan, who is also the chairman of the Needs Implementation Committee, said the money for the earned allowances was released yesterday afternoon, admitting that, although there was delay in the commencement of the implementation of the existing agreements, the government had already addressed almost all of the demands of ASUU except on the allowances.
He also described as ‘unfair’ comments allegedly made by ASUU leadership that the government was insincere and that the government disbursement of N100 billion for infrastructure needs of the institutions was done without consultations.
“ASUU participated in all the meetings where it was agreed to raise N100 billion, which has already been distributed to all the universities. In fact, the president of ASUU nominated one Dr. Baffa, who is very resourceful. He did all the work, and presented the criteria for distribution of the money which is based on the population of each university,” he explained.
Suswan added that after the draft distribution was drawn up, he asked the union to go through the document for their satisfaction.
“Instead, they wrote me a letter accusing the committee of insincerity. The councils are the ones that would verify what we are owing, go and ask them. ASUU said no, that unless we put N92 billion on the table,” he added.
The governor clarified that the government cannot hand over any money blindly unless it verified the need. This, he said, was necessary so that every university would be allocated the money it needed for the earned allowances.
On the N100 billion for infrastructure, which had already been disbursed to the schools, Suswan said the governing councils would be the ones to award the contracts, and not the Needs Implementation committee.
Suswan also alleged that the strike had assumed a political dimension. He appealed to all well-meaning Nigerians to work with the federal government to find a permanent solution to the incessant strikes, which held the danger of seeing to the production of mediocre graduates.
He also urged NANS not to embark on a protest as being canvassed in some quarters. Instead, he appealed to the union to urge ASUU to return to work.
“To raise N100 billion in two weeks is not an easy task. We are making efforts to ensure that this intervention is sustained beyond 2013,” he said.
NANS President, Mr. Yinka Gbadebo, in an earlier address, expressed the intention of the students’ body to embark on a protest either against the government or ASUU.
He also urged the government to consider the idea of interest-free loans for tertiary education students to ease the financial burden on those, who cannot easily pay for their education.
Mr Lindsay said his car's wing mirror, panels and Jaguar badge had melted
Continue reading the main story
A new London skyscraper dubbed the "Walkie Talkie" has been blamed for reflecting light which melted parts of a car parked on a nearby street.
Martin Lindsay parked his Jaguar on Eastcheap, in the City of London, on Thursday afternoon.
When he returned about two hours later, he found parts of his car - including the wing mirror and badge - had melted.
Mr Lindsay said he "could not believe" the damage. The developers have apologised and paid for repairs.
The 37-storey skyscraper at 20 Fenchurch Street, which has been nicknamed the "Walkie Talkie" because of its shape, is currently under construction.
'Dangerous'
Mr Lindsay, director of tiling company Moderna Contracts Ltd, said: "I was walking down the road and saw a photographer taking photos and asked, 'what's happening?'
20 Fenchurch Street which has been nicknamed the "Walkie-Talkie" 20 Fenchurch Street which has been nicknamed the "Walkie-Talkie"
"The photographer asked me 'have you seen that car? The owner won't be happy.'
"I said: 'I am the owner. Crikey, that's awful.'"
The wing mirror, panels and Jaguar badge had all melted, Mr Lindsay said.
"You can't believe something like this would happen," he added. "They've got to do something about it.
"It could be dangerous. Imagine if the sun reflected on the wrong part of the body.
"On the windscreen, there was a note from the construction company saying 'your car's buckled, could you give us a call?'"
In a joint statement, developers Land Securities and Canary Wharf said: "We are aware of concerns regarding the light reflecting from 20 Fenchurch Street and are looking into the matter.
"As a precautionary measure, the City of London has agreed to suspend three parking bays in the area which may be affected while we investigate the situation further."
Mr Lindsay said the developers had apologised and agreed to sort out the £946 repair costs.
Darius I. • I'm a young QS with under 5 years experience, and I've heard this statement before of which I must say had me thinking about the profession. A similar statement was made to the effect that with all the new software around and those that keep emerging, that at some point the QS profession will be irrelevant. I must admit I had my doubts, but I'm convinced that with a constant evolving of the profession pushing the limits and boundaries, tailoring with particular emphasis on the delivery of the QS degree programmes etc, and with continued professional development holistically, that the QS profession is here to stay.
Engineers have always been around and I think Engineers prefer to do what they are trained for which is designing etc, and in any case I don't see a problem with an Engineer being a QS. An Accountant or similar on the other hand will struggle with the technical part of the profession I think because this aspect can only be improved with on the job experience.
Tony W.
Tony
Tony W. • This is a good topic and one I have been really interested in reading about - there are lots of very useful IT systems available to QS these days that are making great strides in accuracy and reporting of materials and so on - what methods of communication are QS using now and where do you see this developing?
Jeremy H.
Jeremy
Jeremy H. • "To say that Quantity Surveying is a dying profession" is likened to saying "construction cost/contract management is dying out of control" implying Developers and Contractors alike would be dying out of business. Quantity Surveying is a highly specialized profession with an increasingly ever evolving discipline that moves with time in tandem with the technological age and relevancy. It's a fallacy that software alone is able to make QS role obsolete. In fact it helps enhance effectiveness of a QS role with less time spent on taking off quantities/bill production with more time spent in strengthening on other analytical aspect of cost and contract management, among others. Don't worry unnecessarily about Engineer and/or Accountant able to carry out the QS works as they have their respective roles to play within the construction industry
Eurfyl J.
Eurfyl
Eurfyl J. • Doctor D Martyn Lloyd-Jones (Queen's Physican) said: "A good Professional makes his job look easy." We have overcomplicated our procedures and squeezed out individual professional initiative.
Gbemibo O. • Guys, Let me refer you to Luke 14:28-30 and for as long as there is need for any form of construction development, the role of the QS would always be undertaken except for those who do not want to finish what they began.
Simon Mark B.
Simon Mark
Simon Mark B. • I think the professional will definitely evolve - but there will be substantial resistance lead from the more mature members of the profession. Then again - they can simply hire the skills to their organisation whilst they take a more 'management' role. On the other side of the fence - whilst standard forms of contract - such as JCT 2011 or FIDIC - continue to cite Quantity Surveyor in the standard terms, then the profession will continue to be very open to the vast market forces incumbant upon the property world. Yes - people will have to learn new skills but this will be fueled by the Universities as organisations have an issue with gaining 'skills' to their existing workforce and they will simply be made redundant and replaced with people who live in the correct postcode and worked for the correct previous organisation ;)
duga E.
duga
duga E. • If quantity surveying is dying then i think all other professions in the construction industry is dead. Economy is a major factor in what ever project you are embarking on. You can not give what you do not have.
Emmanuel
Emmanuel O. • The answer is YES and NO for the same reason surprisingly.....
QS as most people know it today have evolved over the years with a journey from being employed in the Architect office in the old days to the same running an independent firm (PQS) while other employed by the contractor. The traditional QS role (defined from the title itself) was basically quantification or taking off from drawings to produce BoQ. But with time this traditional role is becoming less required as the associated works are now done by automated systems like CATO, CAD measure etc that does the job in fraction of the time previously required. It is worth noting however that people are still required to run these systems; and a QS is probably best suited for it. This said, the QS with his experience is till required in a more refined role of data analysis (putting sense behind the numbers), cost and commercial management, earned value analysis, procurement, contract management, risk management, etc. In short, the QS role is evolving into cost/commercial management with a bit of project controls thrown into it. The big question is... DOES THE PROFESSION RETAIN ITS NAME OR MODIFY IT TO SUIT WHAT THEY REALLY DO WITHOUT HAVING PEOPLE RESTRICTING THE ROLE TO "QUANTITY SURVEYING" ONLY AS THE NAME INDICATES. Many countries and sectors (like OG&C – Oil Gas and Chemicals) do not use the name QS (born in the UK) but instead uses names similar to the roles performed by them. These names include: cost managers, Cost engineers (North America et’al), Cost controllers, Cost Accountants, etc.
Please note that I am not proposing a change of title for the QS; except that I am only passing on my opinion. Change however is the only constant thing in our ever evolving world. I trained as a QS in my first degree but have not been referred to one for more that 10years now in my various roles although I have carried out QS roles as part of my job description.…
MUKOMI M.
MUKOMI
MUKOMI M. • THE PROFESSION CAN NEVER DIE. THOSE WHO WISH TO BE TAKING OFF AND PREPARING BOQs YES THEY MIGHT BE IN FOR A RUDE SHOCK AS EASY SOFTWARE TAKES It UP, BUT WITH THE EVOLVING ROLES THE PROFESSION WILL SURELY LIVE AS LONG AS THE INDUSTRY CONTINUES OPERATING. MAYBE JUST THE NAME MIGHT NEED TO BE CHANGED IN FUTURE TO REFLECT THE NEW ROLES OF THE Q.S. LONG LIVE QSs.
Tony W.
Tony
Tony W. • My experience (although humbly very little in comparison to most on here) has been that the QS people I deal with embrace new methods and certainly software - however I would see that as enhancing their role - by producing more accurate and more frequent reports etc.. overall projects are improved
Eurfyl J.
Eurfyl
Eurfyl J. • Every day on every project somebody somewhere is taking off. The quality of taking off has diminished because of time spent in endless report writing and inadequte taking off training at university.
Mwando D.
Mwando
Mwando D. • Has any one every asked the question, "if Accountants and Engineers start taking on Quantity Surveying roles, who will be doing the Accounting and Engineering?" I may be wrong but Quantity Surveying is alot of work software or no-software.
Steve N.
Steve
Steve N. • My personal view is it up to us to drive our own destiny. There are exciting new roles which have opened up over the last few years, utilizing the traditional qs skills. The industry will always require qs skills if we are to protect our business and clients. We would be well advised that this is why our role evolved. The reason I believe we are struggling to see a future is that certain organisations have been pushing the profession towards cost analysis and accountancy. I am part of construction team, I build, I measure, I estimate, I value. This I can do because I have a traditional qs training, the depth and breadth of this has allowed me to succeed where many others fail. At Octobers seminar I will be speaking on the role of employer's agent which I consider one of the principal routes forward for the qs.
Eurfyl J.
Eurfyl
Eurfyl J. • Quantity Surveying is dying ............ what a load of botox.
Zeeshan A.
Zeeshan
Zeeshan A. • Trevor put it very eloquently. Financial planning and management from concept till the end will always require a Specialized seat. You can put an engineer, a lawyer, an accountant or a anyone who knows the work on this seat. This seat is used to be called as a QS's seat no matter who sits on it. And till there is construction, it can not be ignored.
Massimo P.
Massimo
Massimo P. • Maybe it's more appropriate to say that QS is an EVOLVING profession...perhaps it will be called in another way sooner or later, but its essence cannot be lost anyway.
Motlhabani K.
Motlhabani
Motlhabani K. • Quantity Surveying is forever....needs and demands of the profession may change but QS will live on! It may get called new names to suit the new business demands but the basics of it will continue to be in demand. QS cannot be replaced by softwares nor other professions.
Robert A.
Robert
Robert A. • The QS will survive out of necessity.
Vijaya Sarathi
Vijaya Sarathi R. • The changing face of the Construction Industry in terms of the technological advances, practices and sheer cost of projects have changed the face of QS. I read somewhere that it is a profession which took a definite shape around 1854 and at that time the role of QS was quantity computation & measurements. But now, the field has become so large that contracts Admn., Contracts Mgmt., project tracking, et al are expected of a quantity surveyor, who also is the lead player in contracts correspondence. No sir, I would put it across not as QS is a dying profession but as QS is growing from strength to strength with the changing scenario.
Skills that are necessary for the successful and timely execution of a project are now expected of a Quantity Surveyor. Engineering a project to the goal of completion is more the responsibility of the QS. (eg., if things go awry, the QS of Client, Contractor or any other stakeholder is the first in the line of fire).
John O.
John
John O. • As a first year studying an honours degree in QS this really worries me, am I in the wrong profession???????
-
- -. • I'm a Quantity Surveyor by Job,a Civil Engineer by profession and they designated me as a Quantity Engineer. Any comment?
Maher A.
Maher
Maher A. • Ares, it not what they want you to be or what title they give you. It is what you want to be and what career you want to pursue. I am an Engineer with PhD in IT in Project Management, PMP, RICS and others and my title is Senior QS in this current Job, what you think of this?
Plan what you want, work on it and be determined even if it took a lot of time... you will be there... :) :)
-
- -. • Maher,that was inspiring!Thank you very much.
Finish your contract as a QS and apply your experties as an Engineer..You are very much qualified as a Project Manager."Plan and work on it,"as you said.
Andy D.
Andy
Andy D. • I certainly don't think so; if anything there seems to be quite a call for them. If you go onto most construction job sites there seems to be lots of QS positions.
Sosha A.
Sosha
Sosha A. • Money is the most important factor in construction industry that QSs trained to deal with it... So don't worry Gents, always be positive ,,,,,,,,,,,, If you think other professionals undertaking QS roles it is because there is a illness in their field.
Do you think new software gives this ability to accountants to become a QS.?? I don't think so
Always be optimistic Mr Michael Gyan
Faisal Q.
Faisal
Faisal Q. • The Quantity Surveyor Role is never ever can die, That Major main role for any type of construction and consultant and Cleint. Main Reason not run of Project due to ecnomical crisis in the all over the world.
Alan H.
Alan
Alan H. • Don't fret - the only people wanting this are those who want to build regardless of cost. The lawyers would love the negligence suits coming out of contracts if we weren't around. Have pride in the quality of people that we are. We correctly advise on the effects of late design; design changes; poor performing contractors; late materials; inflation; verbal instructions et al. Without us, no-one would understand what to do next. Take pride in being Quantity Surveyors. A special breed indeed, and a vital profession, not an unnecessary one as the uninformed sometimes like to think.
Peter C.
Peter
Peter C. • I carried out a cost modelling and value engineering exercise for an company building retail outlets (circa £150m in value) in 8 different European countries including the UK.
Guess what.
The rest of Europe does not have quantity surveyors and believe it or not they get on just fine.
The role is simply considered to part of the normal duites of the engineers or project managers.
Non-construction projects in the UK do not have quantity surveyors either.
The role as a seperate distinct profession only exists in the UK and comonwealth countries and then only for construction projects.
That must tell us something.
In all projects everywhere someone has to manage costs.
The overhwelming evidence seems to suggest however that cost management is not the exclusive domain of the QS based on the UK professional model.
Don't get me wrong, I am not anti quantity surveying and good ones are worth their weight in gold.
The UK approach does have its benefits but it will need to dramitcally change if it is to survive.
Sosha A.
Sosha
Sosha A. • Dear Peter Curits.....Im not agree with you at all ....the European Countries do not have QS, But they have Cost Engineer who doing the QS job. Non-construction projects don't have QS because the QSs traineed to control the cost in construction industry. many countries in Middle East, South Asia, Africa, etc. employing QSs in their projects to manage the cost.
The UK construction industry has more focus on the cost rather than engineering and construction. if we compare the construction of the UK with France, you will see that the construction in France is Cheaper than Uk construction. BUT,, if you go to details you will see that UK buildings are more durable and more intelligent than France buildings........... in the long terms UK clients save money. and this is because of QSs.... Furthermore UK construction are more felxible than any other country beacuse of procurement methods, we have different methods of procurment which can be use in different projects But in France they have only , two procurment.................. main reason why UK is genius in construction it is beacuse UK control the cost and has very high Discipline,,,,,,,,, Many country on the world are trying to followe the UK construction industry.......
There are some problems in the UK construction systems but still is much better than European countries or even USA.
Peter C.
Peter
Peter C. • Sosha,
I did say that a good QS was worth their weight in gold and I am definely not anti QS.
However the point I was making is that other jurisdictions for what ever reason get on perfectly well well without them.
I take your point that there are some people who call themselves cost engnieers in Europe (and USA) however they are few and far between and certainly do not carry out anything like as comprehensive a role as the UK QS. When you do come across them they are primarily engineers who who specialise in cost and are nowhere near as numerous nor have they developed into a dominant and seperate profession as we know them in the UK.
My point about non construction projects is that there is no equivalent to the QS profession in projects in other industries such as IT, manufacturing, defence, finance, aerospace etc.
Projects in these industries are equaly as complex as those in construction. However in these environments, cost management is typically the project managers responsibility with input from the accountants and again the engineers where appropriate.
Like it or not the UK Quantity Surveyor is a unique profession. It may well be that we are doing it better in the UK and that we have something worthwhile to spread overseas and in other industries. Of coursea bit of the reverse may also be true.
I would suggest that a debate of this nature about whether or not quantity surveying has a future is best conducted hoilisitcally rather than merely focussing on what we do in our own backyard.
You never know we might just learn something.
Erik J.
Erik
Erik J. • Some of the QS functions may be replaced by digitization, but their skills are still valuable. This may even lead to more creativity and out of the box thinking (well maybe not with QS's). QS firms can still flourish, they just need to increase their range of services.
Alex D.
Alex
Alex D. • My view on the topic of discussion is that Quantity Surveying is not a dying profession and quite contrary is dynamic, adaptive and full of new perspectives and challenges.
I agree in principle with some of the comments regarding the presence of QS’s in some European nations and around the globe, However some of the duties typically carried out by a QS in the UK are carried out by people denominated by a different title i.e. “Construction Economist” in France - “Aparejador or Arquitecto tecnico” in Spain – “Interventor” in Latin America – “Cost Engineer” in the US.
The matter and the fact is that this quintessential British profession has been exported to many different nations because it is widely recognised that the training, the skills and commercial acumen of QS’s add value to projects and as highlighted by Peter Curtis “a good QS was worth their weight in gold”.
I also agree that technology is a big thing for QS’s (i.e. BIM) but contrary to think that is a treat I would regard technology and digitalization as an opportunity... To get more accurate estimates, to facilitate cost planning and control and to increase productivity.... no matter how clever your digitalisation program or software you will always need an operator who understands how everything is interconnected throughout the project life-cycle. Furthermore, you would struggle to get a computer program to go to site do a valuation and or negotiate a tender or prepare contract documents.
If QS’s were unable to think outside the box we would have perished during the recession of the early 1990’s and or the last one (2008) but instead most of the traditional QS firms changed, adapted and started offering integrated services (Project, Cost and commercial Management, risk management, contract and dispute resolution, asset evaluation and management...) long... long time ego. Furthermore the sectors covered by most QSing firms in the UK (with offices around the globe) not only focus on construction but also infrastructure, petrochemicals, aviation, upstream oil and gas and God knows how many more.
The title should not matter so much what is important in my view is to recognise that the core skills of the QUANTITY SURVEYOR are relevant and extremely important and we have moved away from just preparing BoQ’s long...long.. long time ago
Andy D.
Andy
Andy D. • I think a few years ago there was an article in Construction Manager magazine relating to this and how, because of suicide bidding etc, that there was an increased need for QS's due to firms trying to claim back every little penny they could and also a reintroduction of specialist claims QSs.
Editho A.
Editho
Editho A. • Quantity Surveying is not a dying profession, contractors/sub-contractors are really trying to claim again what they had claimed before and in this part QS takes a very big part specially in big projects where huge quantity of materials, equipments could be claimed what they installed and or supplied several times if no QS's are involved.
Joseph
Joseph N. • I don't think the QS profession is dying. Every profession is evolving. New technologies have had a great impact on almost all professions. We should change the way we communicate with the public and our clients. We should make inroads into other areas just as other professionals are making inroads into ours. The portion of M & E in buildings is increasing drastically and we should be abreast with the latest technology. The mining sector is a big area we should take a second look at. I believe any professional who is able to combine the technical, financial and legal aspects in any project will survive.
Do we know the rate of growth of the QS profession in China? Ask those practicing in Hong Kong and they will tell you.
We shall only die if we fail to evolve and stay stagnant.
-
- -. • Mr Nsiah, the QS profession is not dying; stop reading all those anti-QS bulletins. I can tell you that most Civil Engineers are converting to become QS's please ask yourself why can't they stick to Civil Engineering design or Construction Management? Most Civil Engineering students or Engineers are calling themselves QS's as well and guess what: they all come from the far east. There are many in the Gulf states these days. So on the contrary the profession is still alive. I think we already have a mining and minerals Surveying division in the RICS. note that it is not a field for Building QS's but somehow we can adapt and do the job. I am sure there are M&E QS's who started their careers not as QS's but rather Electricians or mechanical services technicians or Engineers and they are better QS's than the building QS; however there are some building QS's who have also good grasp of the subject area. I can assure you that so long as cost of buildings and financial control is concerned the profession will never die.
Jose
Jose M. • I have a degree in civil engineering, I work as a QS, and I come from the far east. I found that Quantity Surveying has a particular way of arranging information that blended well with the commercial/financial side of the industry. But this is not unique to the QS curriculum. It is also found in the masters courses in project / construction management, and industrial engineering and management. But if you want to specialize in design and technology, then engineering would serve that best. The shift to quantity surveying came with the demand for qs-technicians during the construction boom. Meaning, QS's needed personnel to carry out the huge load of measurements so they can concentrate on client-facing functions, and the abundant pool of engineering graduates provided for that. I was among them, and had been working as a QS since. I also undertook academic training to bridge the gap. In spite of that, the best mentors I had that inspired me in the discipline were not qs's but engineers as well as certified accountants who also happen to be lawyers. I therefore say that the QS profession will not die as it is very much supported by other major disciplines.
Raymond
Raymond S. • I am studying at the moment whilst applying for work and from my vantage point I see companies/business asking more form employees as times transpires.i.e. Familiarisation with specific software packages.
Possibly over time Quantity Surveyors will lose certain skill sets through integration of technology into the working environment. I think this has happened to just about every trade known to mankind at some point in time, with special mention to Carpentry.
I think it is important for either Public or Private Organisations to maintain a certain level of competency amongst specific industries so lateral and logical thinking is not diminished within the profession and interrelated environments. After all I am not studying to be surrounded by a group on nongs who have to be told how to place one foot in front of the other. But on the other hand if I the profession was full of nongs this would escalate my chances of starting and maintaining a successful consultancy through lack of consistent competition.
Either way the profession swings, will require participants to adapt with the times of get left behind.
11 months ago
Tomas Jr. L.
Tomas Jr.
Tomas Jr. L. • life is a continous quantity surveying, it never dies wether in business or in personnal life..materials, costs, success, failures, bad or good..it has all quantities to analyse and study....
